Rising Hegemon
And what they should "think" is that the United States should restrict the First Amendment based on what other countries do.
Those Islamists and their apologists who argue for "religious toleration" are arrogantly dishonest. They ignore the fact that more than 100 mosques already exist in New York City. Meanwhile, there are no churches or synagogues in all of Saudi Arabia. In fact no Christian or Jew can even enter Mecca."
Yeah, and no more Synagogues until a Lutheran gets to be Israeli Prime Minister, and no more Cathedrals until we have a Unitarian Pope! No more Presbyterians until the Queen of England becomes Baha'i! Or until the early 90s, "No White Person can run for office in the United States until South Africa ends Apartheid" -- same logic pretty much as "No black person should complain about civil rights in the United States because of Apartheid in South Africa" opposite sides of Newt's same stupid coin.
BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THE FIRST AMENDMENT IS ALL ABOUT! We're better than Saudi Arabia, so American Muslims should shut the fuck up when we emulate it in the smallest fashion. USA! USA! USA!
I guess it's a quid pro quo notion of your rights based upon what other countries do. I'm sure having the United States emulate in some fashion other countries was the whole point of the Bill of Rights...except, of course, it was exactly the opposite.
So, just to clarify, apparently the only Amendment that means anything is the second half of the Second Amendment.
28 comments:
Very well said. And the GOP says Obama is shredding the Constitution? Newt and his ilk are the ones who would do that job for us based on idiotic comments like that.
I guess it's a quid pro quo notion of your rights based upon what other countries do. I'm sure having the United States emulate in some fashion other countries was the whole point of the Bill of Rights...except, of course, it was exactly the opposite.
Someone won't like hearing that!
"The views of other nations, however enlightened the justices of this court may think them to be, cannot be imposed upon Americans through the Constitution." - Antonin "Vaffanculo" Scalia
I'm sure Fat Tony will be all over Gingrich in 5...4...3...
I doubt we'll ever hear Newticles utter the phrase, "Christian nation," but, you can damned sure safely bet that he'll be implying it from now to 2012.
We don't have a Slimiest Politician of the Year award, but, if we did, Newticles would be a perennial contender....
Attaturk appears to have totally missed the point Gingrich expresses here.
Gingrich says that America is tolerant and that Islamists and their toadies attempting to make her appear intolerant are being dishonest. He cites Saudi Arabia as an example of what real intolerance actually looks like.
American citizens have rights to dislike yet another Mosque and to express that opinion in a non-violent manner. What they don't have rights to do is burn down any Mosques, which differs greatly from the certain fate of any Church or Synagogue should one be built in Saudi Arabia.
Gingrich doesn't say anything whatsoever about eliminating any of the 100 existing Mosques in NY city.
"The Mohammedan, if he will to come among us would have the privilege guaranteed to him by the constitution to worship according to the Koran." - President John Tyler, 1843
Vaffanculo, Newt.
[Thanks, Anonymous, for the excellent usage. And, Atta, as a Noo Yawker, I intend to use it liberally henceforth.]
The rightards scream USA! USA! MURKAN EXCEPTIONALISM should anyone point out that other countries are doing better than the US at health care, individual rights, rail systems or this and that.
And yet they turn around and pout "You'd be worse off living in Mexico/China/Saudi Arabia/Iraq/insert world's worst shithole here" to justify bigotry, oppression and corruption. Hypocrites.
amerikkka only has ganders, no geese. freedom for thee, not for yee.
"America is experiencing an Islamist cultural-political offensive designed to undermine and destroy our civilization. Sadly, too many of our elites are the willing apologists for those who would destroy them if they could.
No mosque.
No self deception.
No surrender.
The time to take a stand is now - at this site on this issue."
-Newt Gingrich, from the link.
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tech89 writes:
to justify bigotry, oppression and corruption. Hypocrites.
tech98 rails on about bigotry (and hypocrisy) but in the very same comment manages to write this bit of anti-American bigotry:
MURKAN EXCEPTIONALISM should anyone point out that.....
amerikkka lost its exceptional when georgee arrived.
One word, insensitive...put the mosque outside the footprint of the WTC.
It's needlesly provocative, the WTC was knocked down by folk who (wrongly) professed Islam as their cause...
Just put it a bloc or so away
everybody wins
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
The Founders have spoken loud and clear on this issue. Flag waving frauds can lump it.
"America is experiencing an Islamist cultural-political offensive designed to undermine and destroy our civilization...No surrender."
"And don't forget to buy plenty of Robot Insurance from Old Glory. Because robots are strong."
anti-American bigotry:
MURKAN EXCEPTIONALISM
Aw, get your fee-fees hurt? Perhaps you should re-listen to a few GW Bush speeches, that's how he pronounces it to my ears too. Let's not forget "nukular".
How pointing to some Americans' proudly-ignorant unwillingness to speak articulately, and the parochial ideology that often accompanies it, constitutes "anti-American bigotry" I can't imagine, unless you narrowly define 'America' only as that pathetic fraction of the country where acting and sounding stupid and believing in magical thinking gets you exalted for your "authenticity".
Either way, you haven't touched on the original argument, because you have none. Most of us tuned you out long ago.
Ahh, so there we have it.
Anon at 1:52am confirms his/her bigotry by stating that there's a "pathetic fraction of the country where acting and sounding stupid and believing in magical thinking".
=====================
Either way, you haven't touched on the original argument, because you have none. Most of us tuned you out long ago.
There's a definite level of immaturity here among the regulars.
The weak argument presented to refute my commentary mostly boils down to childish insults or to the equivalent of sticking fingers in the ears and chanting la-la-la-la. Perhaps it's just that you and others here are saddled with arguing from position of weakness? After all, there is an element of advantage (at my base) a position that favors freedom for the Iraqi and Afghan people, the moral high ground.
btw, I did comment on the original argument that Atta attempts to pose in this thread.
above from 7:52am:
//// "Attaturk appears to have totally missed the point Gingrich expresses here.
Gingrich says that America is tolerant and that Islamists and their toadies attempting to make her appear intolerant are being dishonest. He cites Saudi Arabia as an example of what real intolerance actually looks like.
American citizens have rights to dislike yet another Mosque and to express that opinion in a non-violent manner. What they don't have rights to do is burn down any Mosques, which differs greatly from the certain fate of any Church or Synagogue should one be built in Saudi Arabia.
Gingrich doesn't say anything whatsoever about eliminating any of the 100 existing Mosques in NY city. " ////
7:52 AM
Yo! Troll!
America is experiencing an Islamist cultural-political offensive designed to undermine and destroy our civilization. Sadly, too many of our elites are the willing apologists for those who would destroy them if they could.
No mosque.
No self deception.
No surrender.
The time to take a stand is now - at this site on this issue."
-Newt Gingrich, from the link.
vs.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
-First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America.
o/a = dumbass
"...boils down to childish insults or to the equivalent of sticking fingers in the ears and chanting la-la-la-la."
Projector got a new bulb.
Tom -- the site of the proposed cultural center, which will include a mosque, is two and a half blocks from the WTC site. The proposed building is some 13 stories tall, coming between the TWC site and the Cordoba Institute is much taller private office building and a federal office complex. Both buildings block the proposed Cordoba Institute building from overlooking the WTC. And the crazies know this and ignore it.
Just adding that the proposed Cordoba Center is on Park Place, which is NOT within the footprint of the old WTC.
As far as "insensitivity" -- read this article, which describes the project thus: The Cordoba House was supposed to be a monument to religious tolerance, an homage to the city in Spain where Muslims, Jews, and Christians lived together centuries ago in the midst of religious foment.
I'm a New Yorker, and I'm frankly sick of looking at the damn pit because nobody can just tell the bigots to shut the hell up and accept that we're going to build something here, and they're not going to have veto power over it. I'm very sorry for the families of the dead, but a city of 8 million can't be held hostage to their grief forever. Moreover, we can't be held hostage to Republican freakouts over buildings going up in the same fucking zip code, as if it's a horrifying thing that a religious group wants to build a building where the cost of real estate is relatively lower than in Midtown.
Of course, Newt & Palin don't care that throughout the South there are hundreds of statues of traitors who killed thousands of Americans -- those statues are even near the battlefields where those terrorists conducted their atrocities ! Not to mention the traitors' flag flying everywhere and little "toy" nooses.
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I don't agree with Newt Gingrich and the statements in the linked article.
I do, however, agree with his right to express his differing opinion and to work to block the Mosque, regardless of proximity to the ground zero site. As long as he opposes with non-violent means it doesn't matter much to me. And I strongly doubt that Newt or others will end up burning down the Mosque, no matter how distasteful they find its location.
Both interests in the proposed new Mosque are (in my opinion) insensitive, the Muslims for building this close to the location of the 9/11 atrocities and those that oppose their apparent insensitivity with some badly worded opposition.
Gingrich remains correct in comparing the tolerance of Western liberalism to the intolerance of Islamist controlled states.
You know what's on that block, OandA? The Woolworth Building. Church Street Boxing Gym. A camping store. A Citibank. A church that never seems to be open. A deli called Bits & Bites (which makes a really nice bowtie pasta salad). The Park Place 2/3 station. It's not exactly hallowed ground there.
But let me ask you this: if you think "this close" is too close, where do you propose the center be built? Which block works for you?
umm....
Where did I say that the proposed Mosque is too close? I said that the location was insensitive. It was Newt Gingrich that thinks the Mosque is too close, not me.
You said it was insensitive for the mosque builders to build "this close." How is that different than it being too close?
Which block would be a sensitive location, versus the insensitive location of Park Place?
Big difference, Zulu.
Too close isn't the same as being insensitive. One gets the feeling that the proximity is meant to provoke rather than through need for a Mosque alone. IMO the same principle applies with the Flight 93 Memorial Project. Description of the insensitivity of that project here:
http://zombietime.com/flight_93_memorial_project/
Welcome to the alternate Universe of circular reasoning, Zulu.
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